32 Thoughts: The Podcast

00:00 No more theses. Where do you want to go? Okay. I'm done with the theses. 00:05 Yeah. Well, you want to do some smoothing now instead? Okay. We can do some smoothing. 00:10 Okay. I like smoothies. Yes. And now we're going to talk about smoothing. 00:18 Welcome to 32 Thoughts, the podcast. Dom, Elliot, and Kyle back with you once again after a busy Wednesday night in the National Hockey League. And we've got a busy show for you here today, including a wonderful conversation with the now Hall of Famer, Carey Price. That will be a little later on, Elliot. Really looking forward to that one. But we will begin this news block with Matvej Michkov and the Philadelphia Flyers. 00:43 And I have to be honest, I thought this story was maybe going to go away at least for a little while we know the Flyers have been struggling since opening night but the fact that he was leading the team in goals and that looked better than certainly he was for much of last season you thought well whatever the problems are with Philly didn't really seem like it was Michkov centered and then we saw the scene Monday night in Vancouver hoover during the tv timeout in the second period hib and nick sealer getting into it and shortly thereafter kevin weeks reporting that nichkov likely would want a new start elsewhere which left rick talkett danny briere to come out deny the report and here we are the story is just not going away what would you like to add to this one 01:31 First of all, I'd like to say this, Kyle. I have been listening to the last couple of pods, and I have not liked how much I've been rambling. 01:40 Too much rambling. So, as a failed English major, I would like to make this clear so that nobody accuses me of any fraud. I was an English major at university, but don't have my degree. However, there is a way we are told to present... our arguments. When we, when we write essays, present your thesis and make your argument. So I'm going to do that. 02:11 Kyle, would you like to know my Mishkov thesis? 02:17 Yes. Yes. I guess this is the way this is the new format here. This is the new format. Okay. Thesis. Okay. 02:26 Daniel Breer and the Flyers will prioritize Mishkov and do what they can to make this work. 02:37 Okay. Do you want to hear the argument? 02:41 What if I say no? 02:43 The podcast is over and we go right to the thought line. 02:49 All right, then I guess I'll say yes. Okay. 02:52 I have to say there's probably a few people who are yelling, say no, say no. 02:59 Now, did you get here all by yourself, or was this somebody called me? No, no, this is me. I was disgusted listening to myself the last few pods. 03:09 Welcome to the club. 03:14 Remind me to tell you a story a little bit later, okay? So here's my argument as to why this is. 03:23 Number one, this is a team that has already traded Cutter Gauthier. 03:27 who, as the great Ducks media relations person, Alex Gilchrist announced on Wednesday night, is the first player to score 14 goals in seven games since 1992-93, and only the sixth to do it since 1944-45. Mary Lemieux, Wayne Gretzky, Alexander McGilney, Mike Bossy, and Rick Talkett, ironically enough. 03:56 are the only players to score 14 goals in seven games in the last 80 years. 04:03 They've traded them, and you cannot trade that kind of offensive talent twice without doing everything in your power to make it work. Daniel Breer knows that. 04:19 Number two, and I've seen this reported in a couple of places, but I do think this matters to the Flyers. 04:27 In the offseason, they told him, we need you to do two things. Number one, as every Philly fan knows, show up in better shape. 04:37 Number two, improve his English so he can do more interviews and more communication with his teammates, the coaches, and the fans in English. He did both those things. 04:53 Briere feels, and I believe this to be very true, that if they ask Mishkov to do this, he does it, and then they start hammering him, the player will feel that the efforts he makes are are not rewarded. I think Breer takes that very seriously. We asked him to do this. He did. Therefore, we have to show a lot more tolerance and understanding towards him and reward that. 05:26 I think that's very important in Breer's mind. 05:30 Someone did call me on Wednesday, Kyle, and they said to me, do you remember... 05:39 Who Daniel Breer played with in the final year of his career? Do you, Mr. Bukaskis? 05:51 Oh, is he referring to Nathan McKinnon? Excellent. Excellent. Excellent. 05:57 Beautiful job being prepared for your pre-thought line trivia question. Yes. 06:04 So that year, that was the last year of Breer's career. He played for Colorado. He was 37 years old. Now Mishkov is in his third season. He's 21, but McKinnon was in his second season and he was 19 at the time. That was a very tough season for McKinnon. And this person said to me that, he sees a lot of similarities between McKinnon in Colorado at the time. And that year, they were actually not bad. 06:37 They were a 90-point team, but they were in a brutal division and missed the playoffs. 06:43 And Mishkov, obviously, they were a second-round playoff team last year, but they're off to a terrible start. 06:51 Overall, though, Breer sees... 06:56 a common thread between 19-year-old McKinnon, 21-year-old Mishkov, two very, very headstrong, talented players who needed to be reined in and understood. And this person said to me, do not underestimate how much Breer thinks about that and compares the two. So he sees Mishkov as a long-term investment. 07:28 So does Keith Jones, who was on this trip. Like Breer left the trip to go to the GM meetings in Toronto. Keith Jones stayed there. He sees it the same way. So does Daniel Hilferty, the CEO of Comcast Spectacore, their parent company, who actually flew to Edmonton. 07:48 on Wednesday to be with the team. They are kind of united in their feeling that this is a 21-year-old player who will be better at 23 and better at 25. And especially after trading Gauthier, there is a feeling we cannot give up on this guy too soon. And what happened on Wednesday night in a really entertaining game against Edmonton, one of Philly's best games of the year. Unfortunately, they lost in overtime. 08:20 He played 20-44, the most of all forwards, and his second highest of the season. Now, he was on the ice when Edmonton scored the winning goal, but that was kind of a fluke play. I don't know how you felt about it, Kyle. I thought it was kind of a fluky play. Drysdale broke it up, and it just went... It's the wrong guy. Like, you know, when it goes somewhere and there's three guys on the ice and one is Dreisaitl and the other two are Bouchard and McDavid, there's a lot of things that could happen and almost all of them are bad. 08:56 Agree or disagree. 08:58 Yeah. Yes. And it happened very quick. I will just say, if you want to nitpick, like you can tell the default function was, hey, we're going on offense now. And then, oh, wait, we don't have the puck. And one pass later, it's in their net. But it's three on three. It's overtime. Yeah. 09:19 It's going to happen. 09:20 Work in progress. Now, I will say this. I wouldn't be surprised if there was a directive from Breer and Jones and Hilferty to the coaching staff that We need this to work, and we want you to lean a little bit towards the player and put him out there. I don't know that. I'm just saying, in my opinion, it wouldn't surprise me. 09:52 I will say this, Kyle. 09:54 Over the last 24 hours, I heard some crazy stories about the relationship between Mishkov and his teammates. 10:03 This stuff is so sensitive. 10:06 right now especially. And the worst thing I can do is guess. But I think I'm a good enough judge of character to say that this is a work in progress and everyone involved has to make an effort to improve things. 10:23 Everyone. One thing I believe to be true is that one of the reasons everybody is disappointed by what happened in the last 24 to 48 hours is is that there was a recent get-together meal, whatever, between some of the players, including Mishkov, whatever, to work on this. Like a legit attempt. Let's hold hands, kumbaya, work together, be a team. 10:54 And then there was this explosion on the bench. 10:58 And I want to make one thing very clear. 11:02 I'm not saying... 11:04 Any particular player is to blame because I think in these situations, it's to be a true team to win. And this is a team that did win last year, went to the second round of the playoffs. everybody's got to pull in the same direction. So I would warn against saying, oh, one guy is more responsible or one guy did this or one guy is the villain or one guy is the hero. I think they did try something recently to all pull together. 11:38 And then this happened. So I think there was a lot of disappointment about that. But All you can do is continue to work at it. And even though they lost, I thought they played really well as a team. Like, the thing you're looking at when you play that game against Edmonton is, do they lose 10-0? And the answer is no, they didn't. They played one of their best games of the year, and it could have gone either way. Jari was really good. 12:08 Yeah. 12:11 I think also, too, you know what makes this worse, Kyle, is that they're playing terrible overall. Like, last year, this was a second-round team in the playoffs, and... 12:25 Maybe they weren't that good, but they're not this bad. And in their own eyes, they aren't this bad. 12:33 I think that, to be honest, I think organizationally, there's more frustration about some of the other guys who struggled than Mishkov. It's just that he can be such a lightning rod sometimes. 12:50 That makes the whole situation worse. So... 12:54 My thesis is that Briere sees the talent... 13:01 and that he would rather hold on to Mishkov too long rather than jettison him too early. He sees the big picture. He knows what he saw in Colorado, and he's like, I'm betting. It may take longer than everybody wants, including Mishkov, but I'm betting on the talent. 13:27 Kyle. Do you like my thesis and argument? 13:32 Yes, this is very good. This was a good first run, Elliot. 13:36 You'd thought a lot about this. I'm impressed. 13:38 I actually made notes before I spoke. Okay. The second thing I want to say about this whole thing is about Kevin Weeks. 13:49 Kevin Weeks and I do a similar job. 13:51 I want to say something here. He did not make this up. 13:56 Okay? Okay. 13:58 Everybody knows it. Everybody knows it. Number one, he shares the same agent when he played as Mishkov, Paul Theofanis. 14:07 And Mishkov was frustrated after Vancouver, that bench blow up, either he or someone in his camp said it. 14:17 And then when it turned into a firestorm, people ran for cover. Doesn't mean it's untrue. 14:26 I guarantee to you that after that game, someone, either Mishkov or someone around him, was angry, upset, I've had enough of this, emotional, it happens, and it got to Kevin, and he reported it as such. And I think one of the issues here is that the Flyers weren't, that happened to me once before. Like, I'll tell you years ago, somebody told me that Josh Anderson was frustrated by what was going on in Columbus and said that he wanted a trade. 15:01 And it was true. 15:02 But they didn't tell the Blue Jackets. They were just mad. 15:07 And Jarmo Kekulainen, he was mad at me. And I understood because he was like, nobody's told me this. And I'm like, Jarmo, I'm not wrong. But he was mad. 15:19 Legitimately, same thing. Sometimes it doesn't go the way it's supposed to go, but I have no doubt somebody legitimate told Weeks that. 15:34 Right. Now, just for context and to get all sides as possible here to this story, when Breer did media on Wednesday, he did say that he spoke to Paul Theophanos and claimed that Theophanos did not come from him. Did not come from the agent. Fair enough. Anyway, just putting that out there as part of all this. It's got to be a tricky thing because you're right. That is a tough sell to your fan base of going... 16:03 We traded Cutter Gauthier before we could sign him, and now if you decided to give up on Michkov, that's a tough one-two punch. You look at two offensive guys, obviously we know what Gauthier's doing in Anaheim. I get all of that. I'm fascinated from the general manager and organizational standpoint of how to navigate playing the long game where... 16:31 whatever is true or not, as you say, the phrasing of the work in progress within the dressing room, of how everybody's getting along and where Mishkov sees things, where his teammates see things. You saw Mishkov's comments over the weekend about wanting to play more, wanting to be in all situations, and that's all great. 16:54 But it's always that line of how does it go over in the room? 17:01 It's a tricky tightrope act to try to pull off here because... 17:08 As Breer has been very big picture, patient with a lot of things, not trying to put the cart before the horse, the Leo Carlson offer sheet notwithstanding, but not trying to hit the fast forward button in terms of understanding where his organization and the team is at. And yet, day to day, if things don't improve with those that are showing up and putting the gear on night after night, That can be a really tough thing. 17:40 So I don't know what the right answer is there. But I suppose if you believe in the player, and as Breer said, he is part of the solution for the future on Michkov, you've got to stick with it. 17:55 Kyle, someone once told me a great line, the greater the talent, the greater the patience. 18:02 Right. And that's what's at play here. Again, I think it's important to remember that if the Flyers were winning, this probably isn't such a big deal. 18:16 But because this season has gone so sideways and been so disappointing earlier, everything is worse. 18:24 But the greater the talent, the greater the patience. And he has incredible talent. You know, for example, at our place, David Amber, he should have been fired 10 years ago. But because he's so talented, he's still there. Yeah. 18:41 That's right. They believed in him, eventually figured it out. 18:45 Eventually he will become a good host. You know, time is starting to, I'm starting to wonder here. He hasn't got there yet. Hasn't got there yet, but they really believe in Dave's talent. Oh, that is good. Anything else to the Flyers here before we press on? You know what? Can we just talk about the Oilers for a quick sec? Sure. First of all, their record is incredible. 19:07 Jari played really well. I thought he had a great night. Actually, Jari's been pretty good this year. So I wanted to ask you, Monday night they beat the Rangers and the empty netter by Dreisaitl. 19:23 Do you think... 19:25 So McDavid had one assist that night, and he had one assist in this game. Do you think McDavid should have gotten an assist on the empty netter by Dreisaitl? 19:40 I squinted at this really hard because I'm all for keeping that assist streak going, but it looked like... 19:47 He had one anyway. Yeah. 19:50 JT Miller's trying to make a pass to the point. 19:57 And he doesn't get enough on it. It lands on Leon's stick instead. 20:00 Do you not understand that we're going for a points record here? 20:06 Yes, but you can't award points based on that argument. 20:09 Yes, you can. Really? Yes. 20:13 I think you should. 20:15 We are in the entertainment business. Award the point. 20:23 Did you bring that up with Colin Campbell at the GM meetings? I would have loved to hear his reaction. 20:27 No, but we will talk about him in a little bit. 20:32 You know what? No, I didn't. But if I would have thought about it, I would have. And he would have looked at me like I was a complete idiot. But we are in the chase for 215. Give him the assist. 20:48 Oh, you know what else was great about that game? So it wasn't all that long ago on the thought line, we got the question about the timeouts. Yes. And could players call them or was it only the coaches? And wouldn't you know it, Edmonton's on that five on three and Zach Hyman's had been given instruction from Babcock to call the timeout and he does it. And Mike's all of a sudden going, no, no, no, hold on, hold on. I don't want it. 21:14 I didn't mean it. I didn't mean it. Then he goes, it's my fault. It's my fault. That was, that was pretty funny. There you go. 21:20 So there was, and we talked about going, we always see the coaches seem to think we see the coaches call it. And there on Monday night, it was the player doing it. 21:30 I guess the ref wasn't near the bench. So the player got, by the way, so Edmonton, Toronto, well, we've got Toronto's got, We'll talk about the Maple Leafs in a minute. They got Minnesota, and then they got Edmonton on Saturday. 21:46 Edmonton is going to show up in Toronto in a really foul mood after that 7-2 game a couple weeks ago. Yes. 21:54 Yes. 21:55 Really foul mood. Uh-huh. 21:58 I feel like in this... And McDavid's going to be in a foul mood because he was cheated out of a point. Yeah. 22:04 And I think it's fair to say when you look at the head-to-head matchup in this, since Matthews has been in Toronto, McDavid's been in Edmonton, it has been, I think, Matthews has got the upper hand, I think, in terms of wins. Yes. On those two. It's kind of lopsided, actually. Yeah. 22:25 So there's going to be some extra juice there Saturday for sure. 22:28 I want you to go into McDavid's Scrum on Saturday morning and bring that up. Hey, yes, Kyle, what's up? You know, your record against Matthews isn't very good. What do you have to say about that? 22:41 What? 22:45 And no, you shouldn't have gotten an assist on Monday while we're at it. I would have loved to see it. 22:52 Yes, you should have. We're in the entertainment business. 22:55 Yes, that we are. Okay, speaking of entertaining, Tuesday night in Winnipeg. Bravo to their fans in that market for delivering a spectacular scene. They came prepared for the warm-ups, which is all they got to see of Connor Halibut and the game, of course, itself. And on a night where, Elliot, Dawson Mercer scores two, including the game-winner, Nico Dawes picks up the win. I think the nicest touch that the hockey gods gave us was, and look, I felt for Vigo Bjork clanking it off the post on the empty net, but you just couldn't help but shake your head when all of that led to Kyle Connor, of all people, being the one to put it on ice, given his words and his feelings through this whole situation that he shared publicly. 23:44 Yeah. It felt like the perfect bow on a very entertaining night. 23:49 Great night. The Winnipeg fans delivered. It was, in a lot of ways, it was their night and they delivered. Not that any of us should be surprised. One of the best places to watch a hockey game in the world was Those fans were challenged to bring it. They had every reason to be soured on the experience because Hellebuck didn't play, didn't matter. Even though you can still have a party, Kyle, when the guest of honor does not show up, and the Winnipeg fans proved it. 24:24 I have two theses. 24:27 Would you like to hear them? 24:29 Yeah. So how does this work? Do you lay out both? I do one and answer. 24:33 You do one and then the argument. And then two and then the argument. Okay. All right. These are my last theses of this pod. Then we'll just go into general discussions. Okay. 24:45 Thesis number one. 24:49 Thesis number one. 24:52 Sonny Mehta made the call and the press release was written to highlight that. 24:59 Argument. 25:00 As much as Hallobox said he wanted to play, Sonny Mehta, the GM of the Devils, was worried about him in that situation and he said no. 25:12 The thing about the win probability, remember we talked in Monday's pod about how it didn't make sense. The whole thing about win probability, it didn't make an appreciable difference. 25:25 I had a couple people reach out with some time to think about it. Some of the people I even spoke to on Sunday before we did the pod, and they said the more time they considered it, and I think this is true, the The win probability thing in the release wasn't about that. It wasn't about that at all. What it was about was to show that this was not a Hellebuck decision. This was not a Sheldon Keefe decision. 25:58 It was the GM saying, because he knew, and so did the PR guy, Peter Albeids, who's another great PR guy in this league, They knew that if they put those words in the press release, everybody would go to the GM. It wouldn't be on Hellebuck. It wouldn't be on Keefe. All of the bullets would go to the GM, and that's what the GM wanted. He wanted... 26:25 people to know that he made that call. And, you know, the other thing was, and I saw this, I don't know, someone said, a couple people said it to me, and I think it was online. I didn't see it, but I heard it was online. Like, there were some people who said that if Sonny Mehta made the call, he should have been with Hellebuck at the media conference. He can't. The GM meetings were there. The GM meetings were in Toronto. You've got to be there at those meetings. 26:55 And so if it had been any other day, I assume would have been with Hellebock or at least around him. But the reason the press conference was press release was worded that way was so everybody knew it was the GM's call. It was never about win probability. It was about here's the guy you should be blaming. 27:19 Do you buy my thesis? 27:22 I do. Again, I would love to have been a fly on the wall during that conversation. I still, Elliot, one of the The lasting memories of our time in Milan at the Olympics, standing in the mix zone and it was right in the hallway, the side that the Americans came on and off the ice and standing there before overtime and hella bucks leading the way as they go out there. He let out a war cry that I just like it stopped me dead in my tracks. 27:53 Really? Yes. Would you like to imitate it? 27:55 No. It's like, I'd be like, like Lloyd Christmas doing the most annoying sound in the world. 28:02 Dumb and dumber. 28:05 I will not do it justice. 28:07 It was, it was unbelievable. And, you know, of course we look at that as, as the greatest game he's, he's played to date in, in his career. And that, of course, the competitive nature that I thought all of that spoke to. So I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall, but, The reason why it was worded the way it is, I'm buying it. 28:27 Okay. And again, I still, if it was me, I would have refused to let him... 28:33 not let me play. You know, Henrik Lundqvist said it as much on the TNT broadcast the other night. That was very good. This is the way I see it. Meadow wanted everyone to know it was his call, and that's why it was written like that. Thesis two, Kyle. 28:52 Hellebach absolutely was affected by things that happened post-Olympics, but did not initially tell the Jets that. 29:03 Okay. 29:05 So here's where I'm going to go. So one of our teammates, Sean Reynolds, I thought he did a lot of great work around this game. You know, Sean was, when we were in Winnipeg for the Winter Classic, the Heritage Classic, excuse me, we had some conversations with Sean about the whole situation. He was very, very passionate about it. And I thought... 29:28 Sean did some great work over the last 24 to 48 hours asking questions. He asked the question about, what are you looking at? And Hello Buck said, you really want to know? And he said, I'll tell you another time. But Sean actually asked a great question about the Jets not knowing what the personal incidents were or didn't come up to them. 29:55 If I'm not saying the question exactly right, apologies, but that was the tone of it. 30:02 But basically what Sean was saying was... 30:05 The Jets didn't seem to know what the personal incidents were that bothered Hellebuck and led to this divorce. And then I saw there was some debate about who was told what and were the police involved. Look, I'm not getting in the middle of all that. This is my theory. OK. Hellebuck said there were more than online death threats, which I think everybody in our business deals with. It's stupid. It's terrible. But hey, the horse is out of the barn. 30:36 That's the way life goes now. If you're any kind of public figure at any level, you probably get them to some degree. I believe there was an incident that upset him a great deal. 30:48 Post Olympics, there was some insane stuff that happened. Look, I'm a proud Canadian. I hated Canada lost, but I'm not going to lose my mind over that or the American celebration. Canada's won a heck of a lot at hockey over the last few years. And to lose that game by the slimmest of margins, I tip my cap. You earn the victory. But some people did get very upset, and there was something that happened, I think, that affected him a great deal. 31:23 Here's where I think the path diverges and leads us to the issues that some people have with it. 31:33 When Hellebuck initially told the Jets he wanted to be traded, he said, look, I want to be traded to Florida. And it was about the direction of the team. He believed, I mean, if you listen to his media conference, his scrum, at the end of last year when the Jets missed the playoffs, you heard everything he had to say. He believed their window was closing and it was time to try somewhere else. The incident or incidents that bothered him didn't come up. 32:03 Then eventually he moved from one team because the Jets didn't like what the Panthers were offering to open his list. And it was like, I'll go anywhere I can win. I think I can win. And, you know, for example, Buffalo, there weren't a lot of people that were accepting trades to Buffalo, but he was willing to go to Buffalo. But again, whatever bothered him didn't come up. 32:30 Later, when things weren't going the way that he wanted them to go and he hadn't been traded yet, that's when he brought it up. And I think you have to understand, and I want to paint this, how both sides saw this. 32:50 In Hellebuck's mind, he was like, I'm not bringing my family into this, okay? I'm asking for a trade. I want to go somewhere. I want to win. 33:02 And I don't want to drag my family into this. I want to protect my family. And as a father, I get that. Like, if people are mad at me, be mad at me. 33:14 My family's business is my family's business. I get that. Leave their family out of it. 33:19 But on the other side, there's the Jets. 33:23 And they're like, really? 33:26 Now? You're telling us this now? Months later? And they were skeptical about it. They were like, now you're just bringing other things into it that you didn't tell us before. So in Hello Buck's mind, he was doing the right thing, and he was protecting his family, and he did want to be traded. The Jets were like, nope. This isn't right. If this was really the issue, you should have told us that from the start. So this whole thing about what happened when and what really was a factor, That's why I think we got to that point, Kyle. 34:04 Hellebuck wanted to leave it out, and the Jets were upset it wasn't on the table from the beginning. And everybody out there can decide how they feel about that. It's pretty much over now, really. But that's what I think happened. 34:22 Buy or sell. 34:24 Yeah, I just, you heard him say, you don't use the word complex a lot on Tuesday, right? 34:31 By the way, I want to say that was a great press conference. 34:35 Yes. 34:37 That was 20 minutes of great I don't even want to call it entertainment because I don't think it's entertainment. It was 20 minutes of great information. Good questions, good answers. 34:48 Yeah. Everyone came prepared in that room. And he kept saying, using complex when describing the situation, but... 34:57 I guess the more we learn and hearing your explanation of, of what all happened here, it doesn't sound that complex to me when it boils down to it. Like it's felt like it was, it was a two prong thing. There's, I got to protect my family. And I'm also looking at where things are going here in Winnipeg and, and, I don't think I can win here anymore. Maybe he didn't want to come right out and say it to soften the exit. It's clear how his view of Winnipeg and the city, I think that matters to him and how it's perceived by everybody there. 35:39 But it seems like it really boils down to that. He goes, I got to look after my family. Something happened that bothered me. And on top of all that, I don't think this is the best place for me to achieve what I want to achieve going forward. 35:56 Strike one, strike two, don't even need a third strike, and it's time to go somewhere else. 36:02 Am I missing something? No, you're facing prime Pedro Martinez. You're not taking the third strike. I'm just going to sit down now. 36:10 That's on the shoulder. I'm back to the dugout. 36:14 So that's my thesis, and that's my argument. I'll say this about the Jets. They had to win that game. 36:24 There was no option to lose that game. And it really is amazing when you think about them. You go back a week and a half. They gave up, what, 11 goals in a row to Carolina and Montreal. We're doing the funeral march for the coaching staff. And they come back and they find a way to win. They win that game in Montreal incredibly. And they haven't lost since then. But that one, like... 36:53 everything went perfect. As you said, Mercer scored two goals. 36:58 Um, Dawes won the game. Like I know people are going to, I know, I know you guys are all going to be writing to me. Are you a team or are you a club? Um, OK, I know I'm going to hear it for this. I know there's guys saying I'm going to hear this during this podcast because the Jets won. I'm happy to deliver and be predictable. But you have to win that game. You can't not win that game. You have to win it for your fans and you have to win it for Mercer and Dawes. 37:29 And it's amazing. Like we were all, all writing our epitaphs for the Jets. 37:35 nine days ago and now they're back like just outside the race and you know maybe you know what do we say that you only fire your coach when there's no more pushback it didn't look like for between that carolina montreal game for 117 minutes it didn't look like there was any pushback and now they're on a tear um It'll be interesting because, you know, after the emotion of that one, does it wear off? 38:06 Are you spent? But the other thing too is they are so much of a different team when Morrissey plays. Yes. Glad you said that. You look at players in the league who are so valuable to their teams, make sure you have Morrissey somewhere up there on that list because they're a different team when he's out there. But they – someday too, I'm going to find out what was on the board in that game. And did Mark Chipman walk in there, write his name down as Vlad Nemesnikov and put $5 million on the board? 38:41 You even had a Nemesnikov jersey on? 38:43 Hi, I'm Vlad Nemesnikov and I'm putting $5 million on the board. Ah. 38:53 introducing himself just right on the board. Don't, don't blow your cover. And also to fridge, I know Braden Jaeger is still a young player. Like there's, there's a lot, a lot to learn there from, from his standpoint, but like the injection of, of speed and pop that he, he brings when things are going well, like there's, there's stuff to be, there's something to be said there too. Like that's, that's another element that, that they need as we know. 39:19 He's a talented kid, that kid, like you can see it. You can see it. 39:24 No more theses. Where do you want to go? Okay. I'm done with the theses. 39:30 Yeah. What, do you want to do some smoothing now instead? Okay, we can do some smoothing. 39:34 Okay. I like smoothies. 39:37 Yes. And now we're going to talk about smoothing. All right. So the GM meetings, mandatory ones, right around the Hockey Hall of Fame ceremony every year in Toronto. And the idea of smoothing the salary cap. So we know that we expect the cap to go to $113.5 million next season. You had reported, I think it was a couple months back now, the preliminary estimate for the season after that, $127.5 million. 40:07 Big, big jump between those two. So they're exploring the idea of, I guess, going from ordering a big gulp to just a gulp year to year. 40:18 So what they're talking about here is a situation where, like, there's a lot of teams that are really nervous about that 127.5. Like, that is a big number, and it would be the biggest year-to-year jump in the history of the salary cap since it came in. Yeah. 40:39 So basically, the League and the Players Association have agreed to discuss this in the new year. And I assume they usually meet at the All-Star Game, which this year is on Long Island. So I assume it'll be there, although I could be wrong. 40:53 And what they told the managers is that there's a chance that they could... 40:59 add something to next year and therefore remove something the year after. So for example, if they raise next year's by 2 million, it would go to 115 and a half, but you would decrease the year after by the same amount, which would drop it to 125 and a half, which is still big, but it's not quite as Now, I don't know if this will happen, but both the league and the Players Association admitted that they are going to have agreed to talk about it. 41:33 And, you know, some people would ask why would they can understand why the teams would do that. And. 41:41 Then they said, why would the players agree to that? 41:47 One of the reasons is I think that obviously the players who would be UFAs a year from now would have a huge amount of money on the table, but If you were to go to your membership and say, hey, you're still going to have a lot of money on the table, but this group of players will also have a little bit more money on the table, you want a situation where as many of your members as possible can benefit. 42:19 So if they sell it as... 42:21 You're still great in a year, but you guys who are up now will have more available, more money in the system. It benefits all of us. 42:32 I could see them saying yes. We'll see what happens, but that's what is going to be discussed here. Now, other things that came up in the GM meetings is... 42:48 you know, the training camps. 42:50 And this is CBA now. This is collectively bargained. So I'm not sure what can happen with it. 42:58 But, you know, I do think there were some managers who, like, nobody wants more exhibition games. Nobody, Kyle, is fighting. Nobody's fighting to save the exhibition game. 43:09 But if they could get a little bit more practice time, you know, I'd mentioned before that I asked some of the players, because the Players Association is doing their tour to get feedback from their membership. 43:26 Aside from John Tavares, nobody is missing a longer training camp. So I'm not sure if anything's going to change there. But I think they brought it up. You know, the managers, I think, are like – Could we get more practice time? Is there a better opportunity for players who are on PTOs to have a chance to make it? 43:47 I don't know if these things are solvable because, like I said, they're all collectively bargained, but they brought them up. And, you know, the one thing I do think that I heard that I don't know if it will be presented to the players, but I heard a couple of GMs have told me they took away the fitness testing. 44:06 And, you know, I did have some GMs who said to me, they understood why the players felt some of the stuff was over the top. 44:16 And maybe there's a way to regulate this. But I did have a couple guys mention that you want a baseline for when a player gets hurt. 44:27 And how do you know when a player gets injured if they are back to how they showed up in training camp? And I did have a couple of guys say to me, look, if you want to say to us, we can't do ridiculous tests or put a limit on how much Like, no ridiculous skating drills that have guys puking or doubled over. If you want to avoid that, fine. But they do think that there should be a baseline for how you arrive at training camp if you're healthy. 45:02 I don't know if that's going to change, but I know those things all came up. The other thing that came up was, Kyle, and this is something that you are now coming to my side about, is can technology improve calls, particularly at important points of the year like playoffs? You know, for example, there's been a couple of friendly fire situations on high sticks where a penalty has been called that turned out it was a guy's own teammate that got him. 45:34 There's no shame in that. I don't think from the officials, it's a fast game. It happens sometimes. And I think in that kind of a situation, you should, the hockey operations should be able to buzz into the refs and say, hey, like, You know, like you have a replay on the building and every fan of the building is like, wait a sec. You know, why shouldn't you be able to say, hey, it happens, but you missed this one. Take the penalty down. You know, the Caulfield one the other night with Quinn Hughes. 46:05 I hate that call. I hate the fact it's an automatic penalty when the stick breaks and it's taken time, Kyle, but you are finally with me. 46:16 Well, yes. I think the last time we talked about it, the feeling was we both hate that that's a call. 46:23 The problem is now you've got one guy compromised, like they don't have a stick to you. So what do you do? 46:31 And I'm starting to feel my opinion has changed. I think... 46:38 Come on over to the dark side. At the referee's discretion, like an instant we saw... Just call me Palpatine to your Anakin. 46:48 The incident we saw with Caulfield and Hughes the other night, I think it should be treated as, all right, was it a slash? No. Then if the stick exploded... 47:00 Too bad, because we see Elliott every night. There's examples, because almost every player in the league now, save for a couple, use those quick-release steel on their skates, and a puck hits it, something happens, steel gets blown off, and they've got one leg to stay on. Well, play's not being stopped for them. Life goes on, and you chose to use that equipment, and those are the risks that come with it. And now with players using these sticks that are incredible in terms of the technology behind it, the amount of work they do for them in terms of the release, the power that it can generate, the almost effortless, when you have the technique down, the things you can do with it. 47:44 However, they're also susceptible to exploding at a moment's notice without much pressure being applied to it. And I think that should be part of the equation too, not unlike the steel that can blow off your skate. That's the deal you make with the devil of, I want to use this technology, and that's the risk you're on. Sometimes the stick explodes. It's not necessarily a slash. It's a puck battle. No penalty should be called. 48:11 Kyle, I can feel your anger. It gives you focus, makes you stronger. 48:19 And I don't know if I necessarily presented that as a thesis argument, but anyway, hopefully I got my point across. 48:26 You know, that play, that play is the same. I feel the same way as you it's, you know, it's a bang, bang play. And because we've gotten to a situation where it is a stick breaks, we make the call. 48:41 Like, like to me, Hughes is, does a lot more with a stick there than Caulfield does. Like, Caulfield's not even looking at him. And he's trying to make a play. He's looking to where he's going to send that puck. 48:56 But, you know, the challenge of a play like that is what we're talking about with the GM meetings. If it's a friendly fire high stick, you can, you know, Colin Campbell or Chris King or anybody who's in the situation room, they can call down to the official on an earpiece or in the penalty box and say, wrong guy. That's more of a judgment call. And I'm not sure if I ever want to see the day where judgment calls are being reviewed. I think you're just opening up a whole Pandora's box there that is... 49:32 a place we don't want to go down. I just hate the fact that it was like kind of an automatic call. 49:38 Like I said, in that particular one, I think Hughes made much more of a motion with his stick than Caulfield did and therefore led more to the breaking than Caulfield did. But this also goes to my aforementioned Colin Campbell theory, which is that we only noticed something if it happens with a Canadian team. 50:01 He would say if that happened, he picked two other teams, both based in the U.S. He said if that happens in their game, none of you meatheads pay any attention to it. But because it was Minnesota-Montreal, you guys all notice it. 50:18 I'm watching the third period of Utah-Vegas on Wednesday night, and there was a very similar play between Barbashev and Duda, and there was no penalty called. 50:31 I made note of that. 50:33 It was a similar puck battle. 50:35 Barbashev came in with like a stick lift. 50:37 You just made Cole and Campbell's head explode. You watched a game between two American teams. 50:41 Yeah, they're like, no, you're capable. I didn't know you got those games up there. 50:47 And anyway, so like Barbashev goes for like a hard stick lift and then Duda just responds to go put stick on stick to get inside positioning and Barbashev's stick breaks and he's looking at the ref going... 51:01 Why no penalty? And I think it was totally the right call. 51:05 Yeah, I just think overall, I don't think that should be an automatic call. I'm with you on this. Now, the other one that has the Campbell rule of you only notice when it happens with Canadian teams, this tagging thing with the Maple Leafs is taking on a life of its own. This is not a new story. Last year, the Vegas Golden Knights could not extend Rasmus Anderson for the same reason. 51:35 They had to wait. So he signed his extension with Vegas on July 1st. 51:44 And the reason that happened was because they had no tagging room. 51:49 Now, it's not a great situation to be in. And if you're wondering what the issue is, basically, you have to be under the cap for years to come. It prevents you from saying, you know what, we're going to stash $200 million of contracts on our team and deal with it after the season. 52:09 They don't allow you to do that. That's why that exists. So last year, Anderson extended July 1st. And the reason was Vegas didn't have tagging room to do it beforehand. So this is not a new phenomenon. However, because it's Toronto and because they're not going well right now, they're in a real nightmare of a homestand and Bobrovsky is really struggling. It has become a thing. So it limits, you know, that's why Emil Andre was included in the Marchenko deal, because they needed to take his, I think, 1.55 off of initially the first time they tried to make that trade with Columbus. 52:54 The deal was rejected for the tagging reasons. Then they rejigged it. They put Andre in and they were able to get it rammed through. It's a thing. There's no question about it. 53:10 I would be, I'll admit myself, I would be a little more concerned about it If it didn't allow them to trade for somebody with impact that they wanted to trade for, I don't have any evidence that that has happened yet. But this is one of those things that it's like what Colin Campbell says, you only notice it when it happens in Canada. Okay. 53:37 Yeah. And the two bigger factors that you highlighted, all the injuries that have piled up for Toronto and the losses that have piled up lately for the Leafs too, it's become a perfect storm in that sense. And really the big thing, it's the fact that not that they only traded for Marchenko Elliott, it's that they signed him to the extension that kicks in next year. That's what's hamstrung him here. 53:59 You know what I did ask? I did ask at one point if they could have waited to sign the contract later. 54:07 And I just, the, the basically answer I got was that not everybody was comfortable with it. 54:13 Like obviously Anderson was willing to wait. I just heard in this particular situation that, you know, was there any thought about doing that? And I just heard there was an overall lack of comfort with that idea. 54:29 Right. 54:30 Rules-wise, CBA-wise, totally you could if you wanted. They could have done it. They could have done it, yes. Things change. By the way, Bobrovsky, I'm not writing him off. I understand he's going through a stretch right now where it hasn't looked good for him, but I will say this, Kyle. 54:48 On the fifth goal the other night against Colorado, watch how he sags after it goes in. He looks... 54:55 really defeated and disappointed. I have to say, I haven't seen that much from him. You know, we've spent a lot of time around him, Kyle, the last few years, two Stanley Cup runs. 55:10 And I have an enormous amount of respect and admiration for him. 55:16 It was really, it was jarring to me watching the game, seeing him sag after that fifth goal went in to the Avalanche. 55:28 He is really feeling it right now. You can feel that he knows how important he is, and it's hurting him that he's not delivering the way he expects to. 55:45 and the fact that he practiced on Wednesday, the day after the game, which for a guy that we all know, so routine oriented and is not something certainly later on in his career that he has done gone on the ice the day after a game that he was practicing with the group also speaks to just him and everybody trying to, to find answers here to shake things up for, for the better. So yeah, it was a relatively busy Wednesday night, uh, considering across the league. That game in Buffalo, by the way, it looked like it was shaping up to maybe not quite get to the 8-7 banger we got between those teams last year that was unbelievable for all sorts of reasons. 56:26 But man, when it became 4-3 there, the opening seconds of the third period, it was unbelievable. Buckle in. Here we go for another wild finish. And Nikita Kucherov said enough with that. A natural hat trick. Four points all in the third period as Tampa pulled away. 56:43 Yeah, Buffalo gets to within four to three. Okay, now we got a game. Nope. No, we don't. Nikita decides, nope, there is no game. Four in a row. Like, my goodness, what a performance. By the way, Lindy Ruff in that postgame, he was D happy. 57:05 You can blame the defense. It's the defensive structure broke down. Sometimes that's a forward that has to fill and replace, which we got so good at. 57:15 Sometimes it's a defenseman. You break down the system, and you know which guy broke down. I'm not going to get into the details about who broke down on what play. 57:25 We weren't good as a group. I'm moving on. We're playing Chicago tomorrow. Thanks. 57:29 Yeah, yes. It looked like it was a frustrating night on a number of fronts. 57:34 He was going at the officials a couple of times over some things he wasn't happy about. 57:39 And then the result, too. 57:43 They're still trying to find their footing in Buffalo. It hasn't quite come together yet. 57:51 I think that, you know, listening to that, you know, what it does is it creates like a couple of days of people guessing who he's talking about. 58:02 But it clearly, which I think some coaches really try to protect against that. But clearly he feels it's time for some of his guys to feel uncomfortable. I, you know, I do wonder if long term. 58:17 You know, are the Sabres going to regret that they didn't get that hella buck deal done? And one of the things that concerns me a little bit for them is, you know, haven't we know who we haven't seen yet. 58:32 Alex Lyon. 58:33 Yes. 58:35 Yes. 58:36 You know, he hasn't played yet. He's been hurt. 58:40 Yeah. 58:41 We talk a lot on this pod about how Lion is the guy who bails you out a couple times a year. 58:50 Like you're not going very well and he goes on a run and he stabilizes you. You know, you can tell they miss him a little bit. 59:00 And John Carlson, five points. He's got 800 for his career. I know he's an offensive defenseman, but for sure. 800 points as a defenseman, win a Stanley Cup. 59:13 Yeah. 59:16 I think. You know what? He might be. He might be. 59:19 I mean, you know, whatever you count this for. 59:23 I know he was really hurt the way that it ended in Washington, but I got to think they retire his number, too. 59:33 Yeah, I think, you know, when you look at that core, for all the important pieces that finally got it done in 2018, he was as important as any. He had 20 points in that playoff run too. 59:47 On top of everything he does, does well in his own zone. You know, like he's, barring anything unforeseen, knock on wood, he's going to get to 1,200 career games this year. 59:59 That's a heck of a career. 60:01 I will say this. No move that Kucherov made on Wednesday night in that 4.3 period was more impressive than the ghost-like escape of Julian Brisebois for the GM meetings. 60:20 Oh, yeah? 60:20 We never saw him leave. 60:24 Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha. 60:28 That's outstanding. The flat, either he's the flash, like the true Barry Allen flash. Yeah. 60:37 Or he's got powers of invisibility. 60:40 He had the invisibility cloak on. That's right. He did. 60:45 Walking by. 60:48 How did we miss it? Do you remember when Mark Bergevin held the plant and walked by holding the plant in Florida that one time? 60:56 Yes. I wasn't there for that one, but I do remember hearing about it. Oh, yeah. 61:00 So he grabbed the plant and walked with the plant as if he was hiding behind it. Julian didn't even do that. He just. 61:09 Like vapor. 61:11 It was Kaiser Soze. 61:16 Never to be seen again. 61:18 Elliot, are the Nashville Predators... Are they good? Do they have to rethink their plans here this season in terms of what they do with their older guys? 61:30 Well, Chris McFarland told them, if you're in the race, I'm not making calls on you. And they're very much in the race. Six in a row. 61:40 And including back-to-back in California, LA, Anaheim. So good karma points. There were a number of their players, three of them, I think, Saros, Forsberg, and Yossi. They practiced in Nashville on... 61:58 They flew to Toronto, made it on time for the ceremony, and then flew out to L.A. where they beat the Kings on Tuesday before beating the Ducks on Wednesday. 62:12 And clearly Soros in particular with the excellent karma points. I don't know if you watch that game, but the Kings had like five odd man rushes in a row at the start of the third period. It was as if the Predators thought you could only play with three guys at once. Cause every time I looked up, they had a breakaway or a two on one and Soros was fantastic in preserving that lead. That was, that was great karma points. 62:41 And yeah, You know what? That's what he promised them. You stay in it. I don't make calls. So I know he's made 46 trades in three months, but put down that phone because your team keeps winning and they're in second place in their division and third in the conference. 63:02 Yeah, really impressive. And Forsberg, by the way. 63:05 Excuse me, fourth in the conference, not third, fourth. Okay. 63:09 Forsberg, a couple of goals also in that win against the Kings. So more good karma after going to see their buddy Rene in the Hall of Fame on Monday. Also wanted to point out, so the last game of the night Wednesday goes all the way to a shootout between Pittsburgh and San Jose. San Jose rallies in the third to tie it. 63:27 Penguins end up getting them in the shootout. But Chris Letang penalty in overtime. The penalty was one thing, but his reaction to it all... 63:37 Well, he's looking at them like, I can't believe you guys called this. 63:41 I can't believe they called this. You're sitting on the ice with a stick between the legs. 63:45 Yeah. And you could tell when he got to the penalty box, he was, he was conveying that message that what am I supposed to do when I've got somebody else's stick in that vicinity? Yeah. 64:01 That was a good game. That was actually a really good game. That Utah-Vegas game you mentioned was a really good game. Barbashev was flying. Yeah, I really like Barbashev. 64:15 I really like Barbashev. I think he's a heck of a player. And by the way, as you and Dom said, I really got a chance to watch the Ducks in those games. 64:25 in those old school Mighty Docs original uniforms, I could understand why those things are flying off the shelves. Those things look phenomenal. Just incredible. 64:35 Yeah. All the more impressive for Nashville that they beat them while they were wearing those uniforms. That's right. You would think they would be unbeatable. Oh, before we get to final thought, you were telling me you had some wager with Luke Gastic this week? Oh, my God. 64:50 So... So, yeah, I knew you were going to bring that up. The Vikings, Kirk Cousins, he's back. He's home, baby. 64:58 I'm really happy to see it. Lots of great memes and gifs on the internet about that. So Luke loves the Bills, and I love the Vikings, as most people here know. 65:10 And they went head-to-head on Monday Night Football, and we put a bet on it, and I lost. So the bet was $100. And you know what Luke says to me? He says, I don't want 520s. 65:24 I want a crisp 100. 65:28 He is Steve Harvey. 65:31 He is Steve Harvey. 65:32 So what was this thing you were telling me about? If I give you 100 and you give me change, whoever's traveling with me, I give them all the change. If it's 20s, 10s, 500s, if it's $80 a change, I give it away. I don't want nothing except 100s because it's the law of attraction. 65:52 I only want hundreds. 65:54 That's the largest denomination bill. That's what I attract. So I attract hundreds because I don't want nothing else. It's the law of attraction. If you start putting your singles away, you'll stop attracting singles. 66:07 It is the law of attraction. 66:10 First of all, that is no standing pole with Koskis. 66:14 I'll tell you one thing. I can guarantee you this. 66:17 There is no chance Luke is giving any of that money away if he asks for change. No chance. 66:24 Well, maybe not yet, but he keeps stacking them hundreds. 66:29 It's the law of attraction. You heard it. 66:30 Anyway, I have to go get a crisp 100 on Thursday. We're working the Leaf Regional against Minnesota on Thursday night, and I have to pay that man his money. as John Malkovich said in Rounders. By the way, Kyle, I have to say a funny story. So on Wednesday morning, I do my serious radio hit with Scott Laughlin and Gord Stelic. And I will say this. I was up late on Tuesday night. I was working on some stuff, and I was just fiddling around. 67:01 I got to bed really late. 67:02 And when you go to bed late, that 9 a.m. call, for me, who's not an early riser, comes really quickly. 67:09 And so I did the thing and they replay it. I got a text from one of the great guys in the business, Steve Levy. He's like, are you okay? Is something wrong with you? And I go, yeah, I'm fine. What's up? He goes, I'm listening to your replay and you sound horrible. I was worried like something was wrong with you. And I go, no, I guess I just didn't have enough water when I woke up. I didn't get a lot of sleep. He goes, all right, I'm glad to hear that. The information was good, but you sounded bad. 67:41 And then I got another text from another guy in the league. He says, I'm listening to your replay here. He goes, are you all right? I go, is it really that bad? You're the second guy to text me. So I guess either I got to get more sleep before next Wednesday's hit or I got to drink some water because I apologize to Scott and Gordy because apparently I sounded horrendous. 68:01 That is the true Elliot experience though, eh? It's like you're legitimately concerned about his health. You're like, oh my gosh, something wrong with you? You're like, no, this is just another Wednesday. I'm good. That's right. I'm fine. I don't know what you're talking about. 68:16 People are concerned about me for a lot of reasons. 68:19 Okay, let's get to the final thought here. And it really was wonderful. The Hockey Hall of Fame induction ceremony on Monday. We talked about just the neat vibe in the city over the course of the weekend. But the ceremony itself lends way to some wonderful speeches. Just a great, you know, obviously some great players, great people all going in to the hall deservedly. And you see in a lot of cases, different sides of them. You know, not surprising. Berkey was hilarious. Yeah. So we've got our interview with with Kerry coming up. 68:51 He'll talk about that day and just what the last week has been for himself. But yeah, I was it's always appointment viewing. I find. How did you feel being around that on Monday? 69:05 So I walked into Frank Brown. 69:08 Frank Brown, longtime NHL columnist. He's a member of the Hall of Fame for his media work. And then he went to work with the league as a vice president and basically the commissioner's right hand guy. 69:25 And, you know, we were talking about how special it is. And he comes back every year and he's reminded about just how incredible it feels to see all these reunions, all these people come back together and go to the Hall of Fame to see all the history. And we were talking about this and I agree with him. So, you know, the day of the inductions, I went to go meet somebody at the hotel where they all stay at four o'clock. 69:56 And I looked to my left and, you know, at that time, the hotel lobby was starting to get busy. 70:03 And to my left, there was a table full of Boston Bruins. who were all there, like they all came in for Bergeron. 70:13 And, you know, in the thought line coming up, I'm going to shout out a couple that goes to all the Bruins inductions. They've been to a bunch of them the last few years. Mm-hmm. 70:24 But I was really transfixed by it, like seeing all of those Bruins there for their guy, Bergeron. 70:34 And then I looked around. I saw more people who clearly were with someone. And then I saw... 70:42 Some people who were there to see the Kachuks, and they obviously had a big group. And then the former Hall of Famers come back because they just like to be around and be part of it. And then when I left the hotel to go walk over to the inductions, I walked into Josh George's and Shea Weber. 71:02 And, you know, they were there, obviously, for Price. And Weber also played with Pekka Rene. Like, those two guys, like, Josh Georges has a little bit of gray in his goatee, but he still looks the same. Shea Weber, he still looks the same. And, you know, like... 71:25 I think about it a bit myself. Like, I just turned 56. 71:28 Like, I know I am getting close to the end. 71:32 Not soon enough for you, Kyle, but I know I am getting close to the end. And, you know, I probably have, what, 10 years left, maybe. And then I'm going to be put out to pasture. 71:44 And they're really... When I was younger, I didn't really care about... Okay, who goes into the Hall of Fame? Interesting. But I didn't really care about the... 71:55 the tapestry of it or the emotion of it. Maybe I'm just turning into a sucker in my old age. But I really loved... It was really something to see all these guys coming back to celebrate with the people who were going in. Like, it was really... 72:15 It was really something else. I went to Berkey's party on Sunday night. We talked about it on the last pod after I went to go see New Jersey, Toronto that night. And just all the people who were there to see Berkey. As I get older, it means more and more to me, like Frank said it does to him. And let's just say, for the record, he's older than I am. 72:38 Good. Glad you pointed that out. Yeah, I heard that Josh Georges and Shea Weber, they had a busy weekend themselves coaching. I believe they coached their sons on the same minor hockey team. 72:53 I'd heard they were in a tournament and Shea had to leave, I think, before it all wrapped up. Because he was part of the ceremony at the Leaf game on Sunday night. He was on the ice there. 73:04 And then I think Josh made a mad dash from the West Coast all the way out to Toronto on Monday to both be there for Kerry. So it's neat. It's neat. The amount of people that, whether they're retired themselves or they've got their own thing going, put that on pause for a weekend. And it's a priority to get out there for that. It's really neat. 73:26 You know, I do have to say, too, that I went out for a really nice dinner on Wednesday night, and there's a great restaurant, Julietta's. 73:36 Food is fantastic. Went with Michael Russo and Anthony LaPonta, who's the play-by-play voice of The Wild, another friend of ours. Nice. And Anthony... 73:48 said that he is a new listener to the pod. 73:52 Oh, welcome. 73:53 My first reaction was like, Anthony, what took you so long? But okay. Like better late than never. 73:58 But first of all, he said he almost quit after the first pod and, Because it was the one where I said that Morty Seinfeld said Serenity Now. And as a longtime Seinfeld fan, he thought that mistake, it was Frank Costanza. He thought that mistake was so egregious that he almost quit the pod on the first episode. But then he was out walking his dogs. And he said, we got to the final thought. 74:25 And then the pod went on for another hour. He didn't understand how the pod went on for another hour after the final thought. So I had to explain to him how the whole thing worked. But Anthony, we appreciate your listenership, even if it's a weird setup. 74:45 Yes. Actually, can I just say that reminds me, Elliot, like the early, early editions of this podcast, like year one, the first few months. I remember you guys would open the show and you would talk for like 25 minutes and like go through a number of different things. And then it would be like, all right. And then the music would kick in and we go like, we welcome you to 31 thoughts of the podcast. I'm like, what do you mean you're welcome? What have I just listened to for the last 25 minutes? Now you're welcoming me? 75:14 It was a whole, anyway, I got to kick off that. 75:16 You know what that means? What? 75:19 Nothing has changed. I still talk for 25 minutes at a time. 75:23 But now you've got structure. 75:25 That's right. 75:25 Thesis and an argument. That's awesome. 75:29 All right. That was the final thought. We better take our first break because we have more thoughts, apparently, to get to. And our interview with Carey Price. But first, it's a fresh new edition of The Thought Line on the other side of the break. 75:56 All right, welcome back to the never-ending story that is The Thought Line, presented by BetMGM Make It Legendary. So, Elliot, I was in Vancouver beginning of this week for the Canucks Flyers game on Monday night, and I'm sitting up at our broadcast location there in Rogers Arena, in the top level there in the corner, gathering myself before the show starts. And who decides to grace me with his presence? 76:23 One Dom Shramati coming, walking over to say hi. I was shocked. I thought for sure me walking in on his turf, he was prepared to big time me, pretend I didn't exist, but he was kind enough to say what's up. It was good to see him in person because we don't get to do that often throughout the year. And then, as you know, he went off to, you know, shake hands, kiss babies, do the whole thing as he made his way around the rink before puck drop. 76:50 Kyle. Okay. Do you think there's a single person in Vancouver or the surrounding area that would let Dom kiss their baby? 77:04 Dom, don't drag me into this. 77:09 Do you have any like young nephews or nieces or cousins or anything like that? 77:13 Yes. Yes, of course. 77:15 Are you allowed to kiss them? 77:17 Yes, of course. 77:18 I don't believe it. I think this is a lie. 77:22 You're a savage man, Elliot Friedman. 77:26 Anyway, I'm sure you guys enjoyed seeing each other face to face. Did either of you buy each other lunch? 77:33 No, I didn't. I had a busy enough day. I'm not a go for lunch on game day guy. 77:39 I have to. I am not in the least bit surprised by this development. You're stumbling through an answer and he's totally silent. 77:48 I don't. I'm an eat in the room guy and do my notes. I don't. 77:54 I admire those that can go for lunch, sit down, relax before a game. I just can't. I wish I could. 78:02 By the way, we should shout out just our best, our teammate, Dan Murphy. Kyle, you were working that game because Dan's father passed away. And Murph, I hope you and your family are doing okay. No doubt he was proud of all the great things you accomplished in your career. 78:20 Great. Thanks for... 78:22 for sharing that, Elliot. 78:23 Okay, shout-outs. What do you got, Fridge? All right, there's a few things, a few shout-outs I want to give from Hall of Fame weekend. There's a young man named Cohen Eshcock-Hogan. He is a defenseman for the Ottawa 67s of the Ontario Hockey League from Manitoulin Island. I met his dad, Kevin, and his sister, Soraya, who is an athletic therapist in training. at York University. And they were at the Hall of Fame event. And, Cohen, they were talking you up. 78:54 I understand it's your draft year. I just checked his numbers. He's a defenseman who's got 10 points in the first 17 games for the 67s. So good luck, Cohen. I hope you have a great draft season. Your family very clearly, very proud of you. Other people I wanted to shout out, There was a couple, Rob and Karen, they're big Bruins fans. They went for Cam Neely's inauguration. They went for Ray Bork's inauguration. 79:21 And now they went there for Patrice Bergeron. So I wanted to shout that out. That was excellent. I met a young man from Winnipeg, Ronan Mann. He was there with his dad. They run OG hockey, our game hockey. They're trying to bring new people into the sport from all sorts of different communities. Very nice people doing good work. 79:47 I met Patrick McCord at the Devils game the other night. Very proud of his son, Brian, who plays goal for the Mississauga Rebels under 14 team. And there were a couple other people I wanted to shout out. There was a Jessica Adlington. She says she loves the acronyms. So I wanted to shout out Jessica. There was a Bryn Booker, Mark Cupfort, whose aunt, is dr beverly cupford who was my son's um doctor when he was an infant great doctor dr cupford and finally i wanted to shout out there was one person his name was ryan you guys will like this he came up to me and said he used to be a big fan of my work and then he goes where can i watch you now obviously not a sports net plus subscriber Because I used to love your work. 80:42 Where do I find you now? 80:46 Which is shocking because, you know, 80:49 I'm on way too much. Yes. Kyle, I know exactly what you are saying and you are right. I am way overexposed. Yes. 80:59 Nobody needs to hear from me as much as they hear from me. 81:02 Oh, well, clearly the demand's still high. 81:05 Actually, I wanted to shout out also at the Vancouver game on Monday night, Katrina with their game ops came over and introduced herself. She listens to the pod just to have a better sense of what's going on around the league and does a great job with the Canucks there inside Rogers Arena. So it was lovely to meet her. 81:23 Oh, that's fantastic. Great to hear. Great to hear. 81:28 Quick trivia to get us started here. Kyle from Red Deer. Gentlemen, my brother stumped me with this question. Curious if Elliot gets the answer. Name the three players in the top 50 all-time and points to have more goals than assists. The first two are fairly obvious. I could have had a thousand guesses and never would have gotten the third guy. Thanks for the pod. 81:51 Well, one of them is Dave Andrichuk, right? No. 81:55 He's not? No. 81:57 I would have thought that Dave Andruchuk for sure was... No, he's close. 82:01 He's got 698 assists, 640 goals. 82:05 Well, one of them is Ovechkin, yes. 82:10 I'm trying to think of who else would be in there. I'm actually surprised it's not... 82:16 Him. 82:18 I really am. I'm trying to think. Shanahan was close, but he didn't do it. I know that. He was right on the line. 82:32 You know who I think one of them is? I think is Mike Gartner. 82:38 Yes. So that's the one I'm assuming. Kyle said he would have had a thousand guesses and never would have got. Yes. 82:47 Well, I mean, he's a 700 goal scorer and he was known for scoring. But yeah, I could understand that because Mike, even though like he's front and center at the Hall of Fame because he's so involved with it, people just like a little bit more in terms of his career. I'm trying to think of who else. I'm trying to go through like who scored a lot of goals. Oh, Brett Hull. There you go. Okay. Those are the three. 83:12 Yeah, I'm surprised because you know what? I'll say this. I would have guessed Andrew Chuck first over one of them. I'm actually, that was my, I mean, obviously Ovechkin's the number one guess, but after that, Andrew Chuck was my number two, and I just looked. He's 58 more assists than goals. So if it was just only three guesses, I would have gotten one of them wrong because he would have been one of my guesses. 83:34 Yeah, I'd be curious to know how old Kyle from Red Deer is because I think, yeah, if you're a younger-ish hockey fan, I think for whatever reason, Mike Gartner just kind of falls in that area where you kind of read about him and go, holy smokes, I didn't grow up watching this guy play, but what a player. 83:53 Yeah, I think he had the most 30-goal seasons, right, until Ovechkin broke it. Right. Yeah. 84:00 And you know what? Like, again, saw me the other night. He looks fantastic. He has aged incredibly. Like, we're talking about aging with Carey Price in this broadcast. Yeah. They should bottle whatever Gartner's got. 84:13 Okay, Jeff up next. Hi, Elliot and Kyle. Hoping you can help clarify an NHL waiver rule related to the Dallas Stars reclaiming Remy Poirier. 84:23 Yes, a lot of people were asking about this. Yes. 84:26 Okay, good. My understanding is that when a team reclaims a player it previously lost on waivers and no other team submits a claim, it can assign that player directly to the AHL without requiring him to clear waivers again. However, Poirier's situation seems a New Jersey subsequently traded him to Washington, and Dallas has now reclaimed him from Washington. So, does the trade between New Jersey and Washington eliminate Dallas's ability to send Fourier directly to the Texas Stars? 84:58 If so, is there a certain number of days or NHL games Dallas must keep him on the roster before he can be reassigned without going through waivers again, or... Would he need to clear waivers regardless? Would love to hear you guys break this down on the podcast. Thanks and keep up the great work. 85:16 So there's a short answer to make this not complicated. You are correct that the trade changed everything. Now, if a player, the one thing that does happen in these situations is if there are multiple claims on a player and you try to, and you get them because you have the worst record or your lowest in the standings, if you try to put them through waivers again, you do have to offer them up to those teams. So I've never checked exactly if Washington made a claim and that's why New Jersey made the trade. 85:47 Or Washington, everybody knew they needed a third goalie because they lost Clay Stevenson on waivers. So maybe, I don't know if it was because they... 85:58 needed the goalie or they had to offer them to him. 86:02 But you do have to do that. The trade changed everything that ruined Dallas's ability to just send them down. So the answer to your question is yes. And a guy like Remy Poirier, if you clear waivers, then you don't have to do it again until you've either played 10 games or you've spent 30 days on an NHL roster. Once you've reached one of those two, you have to go through waivers again. 86:36 But in this particular case, the trade changed the entire situation. 86:43 All right, very good. We have a voicemail up next from Izzy. 86:47 Hey, this is Izzy, big Detroit fan. I have been kind of following all these Websites showing the Dylan Larkin bucks and hella bucks as the players lose money from their holdouts. And it got me curious with all these new contracts that are heavily signing bonus front loaded, what happens if a player like Leo Carlson who gets $18 million signing bonuses each year gets his bonus and then decides he's going to pull a Larkin and just say, I'm not going to play. 87:20 Can the signing bonus be clawed back? Or are they just going to be docking his $900K salary for the year? 87:28 Thanks for the answer. 87:30 Izzy, that is a great question because that is at the root of a lot of this is signing bonuses. And the answer is the signing bonus that has already been paid, it can't be taken back. 87:50 So it becomes the daily payment on what is still owed to you. 87:56 Now, it's interesting you bring this up because it has been an issue. In some of these cases where a signing bonus is paid, if a player asks for a trade or withholds his services, There are teams and the league who get really angry about that, and they consider it kind of like an extra violation. For example, when Mike Comrie was a member of the Oilers and then there was a contract dispute and a fight, they had a deal to trade him to Anaheim that fell apart because the Oilers asked him for some of his signing bonus back. 88:35 And there was a huge fight over that. He didn't end up paying it back, and he also ended up getting traded to Philadelphia. But that's how nasty that particular situation is. Also, there have been a couple of cases recently where players – where players terminated their contracts to go sign as free agents elsewhere. And in cases where signing bonuses were paid, the league had a problem with that. Like, for example, David Kampf last year, he terminated his deal from Toronto because he didn't want to play for the Marlies anymore, and he went back to Czechia. 89:13 But eventually it was allowed to happen, but the league wanted him to pay back a signing bonus. They didn't like it. 89:20 So that has been a fight. So far, I don't know of any cases where a player actually had to pay it back, but it has been an issue. 89:32 that Mike Comrie fallout at the end of Edmonton. There was some wild behind the scenes stories with, with that one. Hey, like I, cause they were in talks with Anaheim for a while. And I think again, the signing bonus became a sticking point over why it all kind of broke down there. 89:50 And I know like Corey Perry was one of the, we, one of the players like that would have been in conversation, potentially be going back to Edmonton. He was going back. 89:58 He was going back. That's true. Yeah. Yeah. 90:01 That's wild. 90:03 Great question, Izzy. Thank you for that. Okay. 90:06 R is our next submission from Stavanger Norway. 90:12 Hi, guys. Oh, okay. All right, nice. 90:15 Greetings to our Norwegian fans. 90:17 Do you think head coaches text each other like, should we go with the backups tonight when planning to start their backup goalie? Over the years, I just feel it's more common to see backups facing each other rather than bonafide number ones versus clear-cut number twos. Can't just be a coincidence, right? For example, Calvin Pickard going for the Wild and Dennis Hildeby for Tampa Bay. 90:40 Love the show. Let's go Buffalo. 90:42 That's a good question. 90:50 I bet in preseason there's a bit of that. What are you thinking? And not just goalies, but lineups in general. Who are you thinking of dressing? Yes, I agree with that. 91:00 I think, I mean, the example that R pointed out here, I mean, both the Wild and Tampa played back-to-backs that weekend. Like, it was the second game for Minnesota Saturday. It was the first for Tampa on Saturday. 91:14 So, you know, you knew you were going to play your backups one of those two games, however it played out. I remember... 91:21 One year living in Ottawa, it felt like any time a visiting team came in there, they were always getting the backup. Ottawa didn't have a great team that year. Let's see if it was always the number two guy that was getting the start in Ottawa. But I would think it's more of a coincidence than head coaches discussing and trying to plan who the goalies are on a given night within each other. 91:47 You know, I think that most teams do it with their own sports science now. So generally, I think you're believing we'll handle what we want and the other team can do what they need to do. But it wouldn't surprise me on some level, Kyle, that If a coach and his goalie coach will say, hey, if we have a back-to-back and this other team is a back-to-back, who do you think we might see in that second game for the other team? And do we think we have a better chance of winning if we throw our number one guy in there against their backup? 92:24 I wouldn't be surprised if that happens. I think there are coaches and teams that would think like that, especially as we head into a more analytic era. I find it hard to believe that there wouldn't be somebody who's come up with a model or a way of trying to determine that. 92:41 Right. And we're going to hear from Carey Price here in a moment, Elliot. I remember that that was the word there when it came to back-to-backs with the Canadians when he was their number one guy. If it never was really... And typically, you play your best guy the first night, your backup gets the second night. In Montreal, if there was one of those back-to-backs at home, one on the road, it was always about making sure that Price played the home game. They felt that they... 93:08 Their season ticket holders, their corporate ticket holders demanded that whenever possible, Price had to play at home. He was that much of an attraction and the marquee guy, of course, back then, that they always felt they had to do whatever possible to ensure Price got as many home starts over the course of the season. 93:29 I do remember, by the way, when you talk about Ottawa that year, I remember when the Maple Leafs started to turn a bit under Pat Quinn, going from the top team they'd been to, they were struggling, they were going down the standings. 93:45 All of a sudden, every game I went to in Toronto, the other team's backup was playing. That's when I said, other teams see where this is going. 93:53 That's the canary in the coal mine. Yes, yes. 93:58 Okay, last one here, Elliot. Matt from St. Peter's, Nova Scotia. Good evening, gentlemen. During Sunday's Maple Leaf broadcast, former NHLer Mike Johnson mentioned that he scored his first and last career goals against the same goalie. Patrick Lalim. Mike scored 129 career goals total. Has any other player with at least 100 career goals scored both his first and last against the same goalie? 94:34 Holy cow. 94:38 I got to think maybe someone in there. You know what? Somebody had to have done it. 94:43 Somebody had to have done it. 94:46 Yes, that is correct. 94:50 Mike Johnson is one of five. Five? In history. Yeah. How long ago? 94:56 Three were, one was a long, long time ago. Two were fairly long ago. One was actually more recent than MJ. 95:08 Slightly. 95:09 More recent than MJ? 95:10 Mm-hmm. 95:17 Was the goalie like the more recent one, was it like the elite tier of goalie? Was it like Brodeur, Joseph, Belfort, like that kind of a guy? 95:28 I wouldn't put him in that category, but he had a long, successful career and, like Mike Johnson, made a great transition to broadcasting. 95:45 It wasn't anyone we've worked with, was it? 95:49 No. 95:51 Don't think so. 95:53 Was it Brian Boucher? Yes. 95:58 I'll take that. 95:59 I will take half of the equation. Who did? And the shooter was John Madden. 96:06 Really? Yeah. And it's quite the span. His first goal, October of 99, and his last, April of 2012. 96:17 Same goalie. 96:19 Wow. 96:20 What? Okay. So, and then where are we going here for the older guys? 96:24 Well, I should just tell you. No, look, give me... You want to guess the goalies? 96:28 Yeah, quick guesses, if I could. Yes. 96:31 All right. 96:32 So, two... 96:37 Spanned the 60s and 70s. 96:42 And the other one was, I would say, the early years of the NHL. 96:47 Like the early years of the NHL. Is it like George Vezna? George Hainsworth? 96:54 Like it's like that. Frank McCool. Kind of era. Like we're... Cy Denany. 97:03 Keep going. 97:04 I'm trying to remember who else played gold back then. Like Roy Werders, Tiny Thompson, Frankie Brimzik. 97:12 Technically, this guy was the first to support any type of facial protection. 97:20 Wasn't that Denany or Dennehy or something like that was the first? Oh, Clint Benedict. Yes. 97:26 Clint Benedict. That's who it was. Yeah. But that hint I got. Wow. Who's the shooter? Joe Malone. 97:33 Well, I mean, I've heard of Joe Malone, most goals in the game, seven. 97:36 Yeah, that's right. 97:38 Okay. So then we're in the 60s and 70s. We'd like talking Rogie Vachon. 97:43 Wow. Yes. That's one of them. 97:45 Are you kidding me? Wow. That is such a fluke. 97:50 Bill Fairburn was the shooter. 97:52 Okay. I mean, I know Bill Fairburn, but I never would have got that. 97:56 Like Ed Giacomo. Oh, my God. Fringe. No way. Are you kidding me? 98:02 Pure guess. Pure guess. I was just thinking, guys... 98:06 Who was the shooter? Son of a gun. Like, again, you just backwards somersault into these all the time. 98:13 It is ridiculous. 98:15 Yes, I know. It's hilarious. 98:17 Who's the shooter? 98:19 Pronouncing this right, is it Simon Nollet? Simon Nollet. Simon Nollet, there you go. 98:24 So he was, and afterwards... He became, he's an excellent scout. Like he was, he became the, if I'm not mistaken, he became the Flyers Quebec scout. Simon Gagné was one of the guys that he found. So he was a talented player and a great, a great scout. 98:46 That is incredible. 98:49 I thought it was foolish to try to have you guess names here because it's such a unique thing we're talking about. 98:54 Well, you know what? You gave me some hints. I'm never getting Clint Benedict without you telling me that. And you said 60s and 70s. 99:02 I know, but there would have been a lot of goalies that played in that time. And you went two for two. 99:10 Yeah. Like Ken Dryden. 99:13 Yeah. All would have been valid guesses, but you went two for two. 99:17 You batted a thousand. It's crazy. I should just quit my life right now. 99:22 This is, this is the pinnacle. Yeah. 99:26 Gosh, that's awesome. 99:29 Good question, Matt. Thank you for submitting that. And we will leave it there. Another edition of the Thoughtline. If you'd like to partake, please do send an email at 32thoughts at sportsnet.ca or drop us a voicemail at 1-833-311-3232. We'll take another break and come back with our conversation with Hall of Famer, Carey Price on 32 Thoughts, the podcast. 100:11 For his entire career, Carey Price preferred to let his play do the talking, and his play often spoke volumes. And for all the great goaltenders that made Hall of Fame careers in the Montreal Canadiens crease, no one has more wins for that franchise than Price's 361. And now Price himself, rightfully, is a Hall of Famer as well. Carey had a very busy week, but despite all of that, he was Kind enough to make some time for us to reflect on what he had just experienced, share some great stories about his career and what keeps him busy now as a family man, and also discusses his partnership with Energy Bird. 100:51 Here's Carey Price on 32 Thoughts, the podcast. 100:54 We hope you enjoy it. 100:56 Well, Kerry, first of all, I know by your own admission, you have always been most comfortable when in the spotlight doing what you love to do, and that is play hockey and play goalie and that. But the last week or so, you've been in the spotlight doing something that you've never really sought out to do, and that is speak publicly. But it's all been wonderful from the Hall of Fame ceremony to Tuesday night in Montreal. How are you feeling after this last week? 101:20 Uh, I'll be honest, I'm a tad bit relieved. 101:25 You know, it was obviously a very special time for me and my family. 101:31 I always felt a lot more comfortable in the crease, like I said last night, than I did, you know, giving speeches. So I'm thankful that part of it's over, but I wish, you know, this feeling would continue to last, I suppose. 101:48 Kerry, I loved your speech. When you went into the Hall, I thought it was a fantastic, fantastic speech. Very true to who you are and who you always have been. And sometimes I think that when you go into the Hockey Hall of Fame, Um, you know, people out there need to know that you're like every single one of them. You have your challenges and you find a way to overcome them. And I just love the fact that you said, I'm not a perfect person, but I am here. 102:21 I just thought, I just want you to know, I thought that was a great message. 102:25 Yeah. I think that resonates and it's, you know, just truthful, you know, not, I'm not perfect. And, you know, I've been, been blessed with, uh, with a lot of opportunities in my life and have had just an, uh, an amazing journey and I'm thankful for every step along the way and all the lessons that I've learned during it. So it's been, uh, it's been a pretty, pretty wild ride, but it's been very enjoyable. I've been, you know, just blessed to have such good people in my life to help me along the way. 102:57 So I wish I could have sat there and named names for half an hour, you know, but you know, I don't do so well with names and stages. 103:07 Did you write your speech yourself or did someone like, did you, I don't know. Did, did Angela, did she, was she the one who kind of proofread it or your dad or who kind of did it with you? 103:19 No, I had kind of a general idea of what I wanted to say. I knew I wanted to keep it brief because I knew I was going to get emotional up there. 103:28 And there are so many things that I wanted to say up there, and I just knew I wasn't going to be able to get through it. When I sat down and read it, and I wrote all this myself, and I... 103:41 was sitting down in my shop reading everything, and I was, like, getting emotional by myself with nobody there, not in the moment. I was like, okay, I got to edit this and take this out because there's just no way I was going to be able to get through it. So I tried to simplify it as much as I could and keep it brief. I didn't know. They gave us five minutes, right? Yep. 104:01 So I was like, okay, I know probably... 104:06 Walt is probably going to go a little longer, possibly. 104:11 I thought Berkey might go longer too. And I've never been a man of a lot of words. So I just try to keep things as simple as possible. 104:20 And again, I wanted to say something from the heart that I could get through and try and convey my emotions in a way that wouldn't be overbearing on me, but still get my point across. 104:36 That's awesome. What were the things that, because obviously all the inductees, there's equipment and jerseys and such that they'll donate to the hall. 104:45 What were the things that you handed over? 104:47 Yeah, so I gave a pair, a set of pads that I wore in Tri-Cities. 104:55 And then I gave the last set of pads, gloves, and masks that I wore in the NHL. So those are the last set that I ever worn to this day. I still haven't worn pads yet. So I gave multiple jerseys, sticks, cards. 105:14 I collected a lot of stuff throughout my career. So I had a lot of options. Yeah. 105:22 I always wonder, you've got three kids now, and I always wonder what they say. 105:27 I don't remember, Carrie, I think your first daughter was born in 2016, so I don't know how much they really remember of you playing. So when your kids see this kind of ceremony for you, what was their reaction? Is it like, Dad, you're a bigger deal than we thought kind of thing? 105:50 Liv remembers. She would have been, what, about six, I think, when I finished playing. Millie was little. She was a toddler still. 106:02 Lincoln doesn't remember anything. He was just a baby, my last game. 106:07 I think, you know, I think they've kind of, I think they understand, like, you know, like, people approach me all the time and they kind of get a taste of it, but they haven't really seen me kind of in the spotlight like that before, I don't think, you know? Mm-hmm. 106:26 Um, Lincoln was very concerned last night. They brought all the trophies out, and he thought they were all the ones that were in the funhouse. You know, our funhouse is kind of like a memorabilia room full of trinkets and whatnot. So he was very concerned about me being able to get those back at the end of the night. So... 106:49 That is outstanding. Were you able to settle him down? Like, was he able to hear the explanation okay of why those were there? 106:58 Yeah, I think so. It was kind of a lot to take in, you know. Yeah. 107:03 Jeff invited us to his suite last night, so we kind of had a little bit of time to enjoy the game, but there was a lot of seeing people that have had influence in my career, and I was kind of meet and greeting a lot, so it was an enjoyable experience, but it was also... 107:23 trying to navigate being thankful to everybody at the same time. 107:29 I got to sit down for a while and watch the game with the kids. They all had a ton of fun up there. They got to see Yuppie. My oldest, Lev, she was terrified of Yuppie pretty much her whole time here. So... 107:47 How was she last night? 107:48 How was she the other night? 107:49 Yeah, really good. I think all the kids enjoyed the moment. I think it's tough for a kid to sit, you know, for that long listening to speeches, you know, but I thought everybody did really good. 108:03 Yeah. Well, that ovation on Tuesday, Kerry, I mean, it came in at over four minutes. How long did it feel standing there? 108:11 It didn't feel, obviously, it was great. It didn't feel that long to me only because I was trying to collect myself emotionally the whole time. 108:23 You know, like I was standing in the hallway at the doors watching the video, which I could hardly watch because I had to like, you know, gather myself. 108:35 And then when I got out on the ice, the ovation kept going. And for the first two minutes, I don't think I would have been able to speak, to be honest. I was so overcome with emotion that I'm really thankful that it went that long because it gave me an opportunity to kind of collect myself. 108:55 You know, Kerry, you've been back in Montreal before and you've had ovations before. 109:01 I guess it doesn't get any easier for you to handle feeling the love, but in a good way. 109:08 Yeah, definitely. 109:11 At one point, it was like deafening in there, you know. 109:14 And I knew it was going to be special, and I knew I was going to be very emotional. 109:20 I just can't thank the fans enough for that. Again, that's just the passion for hockey that is here. It truly is what makes this place special, and to have been a part of that for other players and be a part of that as a player, it was special to... 109:42 just to be there and experience it on a different level. 109:47 I wondered, your children, the three of them, have any of them ever expressed a desire to be a goalie? 109:55 No. 109:57 Levin Millie, my two oldest, never really showed interest in playing hockey. Well, they didn't. They're not even really in skating that much. 110:08 Lincoln is now starting hockey. 110:13 prefers baseball oh nice but I asked him if he wanted to play goalie and he's like nope thank goodness I was going to say who was happier you or Angela probably both of us but he was asking a lot of questions about goalies last night so I don't know we'll see but I'm kind of hoping we're going to be spending more time at the ball diamond what position does you play there Everything? Yeah, they're at an age where they're just learning the game. 110:44 You know, they're just out there having fun. Some kids are building sandcastles in the diamond and, you know, and then in hockey, you know, it's kind of the cluster chasing the puck around. So he seems to be enjoying it. So that's what we're there for. 110:58 Now, if I caught it right in your speech, at one point you're thanking all the teammates that played in front of you for blocking shots and all the sacrifices they made. And you said, now as a forward, the things that you never do. So are you still on the ice playing games recreationally, just not in net? 111:15 Yeah. 111:17 Honestly, I don't think my knee could play goal. 111:22 Right. 111:24 You know, I do play out. I play forward primarily. Go back to D, which I feel more comfortable doing because it's the plays in front of you and I actually feel like I know what I'm doing back there. 111:34 But I play forward. I enjoy, you know, getting out. I usually play two or three times a week, you know, depending on how my knee feels. Usually by the end of the week, it's barking at me a little bit, but... 111:49 I get out and play with three groups throughout the week. 111:56 It's a closed group of guys. You skate with the same guys every week. 112:03 There's some guys out there that that have played before like the tuesday group i just i jumped in there and there's a couple of guys like webs comes out and skates with us cody franson skates with us there's several guys that come out and then uh we have uh thursday nights the tnhl we call it thursday night hockey league And all those guys are primarily fellas that have played at some point in their lives professionally, collegiately. 112:35 So that's pretty fast-paced hockey. And Friday is just a group of guys that invited me a couple of years ago and I have a lot of fun playing with them too. 112:45 So here's the big question though, Kerry. Has Weber pummeled anyone, like just clobbered anyone in any of these games? 112:53 No, no, we're, we're, we're all getting too old for that now. Go ahead. Uh, so there was one time where, uh, you know, I happened to slip by him and then the next time he, uh, came at me like he was going to go through me you know and I just remember like looking up thinking this is terrifying you know so yeah I just like every time every time I come down I get the puck I'm skating down his side of the ice I just skate across to the other side because it's just like what do you do You're like, now I understand. 113:36 Yeah, I'm just going, I'm going to take it over here as far away from him as I can. 113:39 Now are slap shots allowed in these skates? No slap shots, yeah. 113:44 I remember, I think it was the first skate I took a slap shot and I got the look, so no more slap shots after that. 113:51 You know, I was at a charity event. Eric Lindros did an Easter Seals charity event last Friday, and it was a great event, but one of the teams was complaining. Sam Gagne took a slap shot, and everybody was so surprised, and he missed, but they scored off the rebound, and the team that lost was furious. So I've forgotten how hilarious this whole slap shot situation is in these games. 114:19 Yeah, I kind of get it. Nobody wants to take one off the laces or break the goalie's hand, you know, so I get it. 114:27 I walked into the hotel on Monday afternoon to meet somebody and I saw like just the whole Bruins team basically there to see Patrice Bergeron. And when I was leaving, I walked into Shea Weber and Josh Georges who were there to see you. And I was reminded, Carrie, of what a great event this is for reunions. Yeah. 114:49 You know, just who was there for you that you were that you were really happy to see? And just, you know, I know you see some of these guys, as you mentioned, Shay, but just how, you know, when you when you sat there with your group and your former teammates and your friends, what stood out for you about it? 115:08 Yeah, we had the opportunity to invite a large group to a retirement slash Hall of Fame party down in Wyoming earlier this summer. So I got the opportunity to see a lot of those guys. There's so many guys that I wish I could have invited. Space is limited at these things, and there's so many guys that had a lasting impact on my career and that I'm still friends with today. 115:38 And there was a few guys there last night, you know, kind of the usual suspects. You know, obviously Shea was there and PK was there. 115:47 Jeff Petrie was there. Who am I forgetting? 115:56 Some of those guys look like they haven't aged. I was looking at them. 115:59 Yeah. So, you know, there's a lot of guys that I keep in contact with, but, you know, Originally, I just kind of wanted it to be intimate with just me and my family. And then the requests started trickling in. I was like, okay, we'll happily accommodate you. But it's hard to invite everybody. 116:24 There's just so many guys throughout my career playing in one place. Yeah. 116:29 I think Dave Stubbs mentioned I played with over 200, I think it was like 50 players in my career. 116:37 It's a lot of guys. 116:39 So many of those guys I just had so much fun with. 116:44 We had so many really close-knit teams and just enjoyed so many memories. That's why I mentioned in my speech, I feel like I have enough memories to last three lifetimes. Just thankful for my time with everybody. 116:59 Well, and it's great to hear that you're still, like you feel good enough that you're able to get on the ice a couple times a week. But just obviously understanding, Kerry, the role that injuries played in your career, how is the quality of life now? I know being outdoors is a big thing for you still. How's the day-to-day? 117:16 Day to day is good. 117:19 Aside from kneeling and old man stuff, you can hear the creaks and cracks of a lifetime playing goal. But in general, I'm very thankful for the health that I do have. Definitely didn't escape unscathed, but I'm thankful that I can still go hiking in the mountains and Still bothers me at times, you know, it's not a teenage knee anymore, you know, but I'm thankful for the health that I do have. 117:52 So you've started some involvement here with a product. Is that to help you with like your recovery and things like that? Is that why you started to get involved in this and tell us about it? 118:04 Yeah, so Energy Bird was a partnership that I was approached with and I tried their products before I agreed to it. I've always taken supplements throughout my career. I think they're pretty important for, you know, not only, especially for a professional athlete as you're going through your career, but, you know, as I age and move forward with life, I want to continue taking care of myself because, you know, your health is the most important thing. 118:35 I have to say that I was looking at you and I was looking at Bergeron and just like some of the guys that are involved here. And it doesn't like, again, it doesn't look like you guys have aged a bit. Like you both still look the same. 118:49 I'm amazed. Like I'm 56 years old and I look like I'm 556. Like I can't believe how well you guys age. 118:57 Yeah, I've been accused of being a vampire before. 119:10 I take that, man. I would take it. You know, I wanted to ask you, have you seen Devin Cooley? Have you seen his interviews? 119:19 Yeah, yeah. Pretty interesting. Yeah. 119:21 What do you think? Because you talked before about how there's sort of like the person carry price and the goalie carry price. What do you think when you watch him? 119:33 I don't know. I like it. You know, it just lets it all hang out there and, you know, just speaks what it is. You know, I appreciate that. 119:44 When I moved to Montreal, Carrie, I was told and learned, obviously, pretty quickly that when it comes to the times that you did speak publicly, obviously, you didn't say any more than you needed to. And you just, as it was explained to me, you understood that. 120:00 the weight that your words carried in that market because of your role there, the position you played and all of it. How long into your time in Montreal did you realize, okay, when I say something, there's the potential for it to get traction and is how you navigated that the remainder of your career? 120:22 yeah I think that came pretty early you know like I think it's you know for me personally like I just wanted to focus on playing hockey and the less I said it seemed like If I could keep things as simple and vanilla as possible, it was like the less I had to deal with, right? 120:49 So I think especially in a hockey market, you want to just try and focus on your job and not have to deal with something that you said when you were emotional for the next week. 121:04 It was just easier to do it that way. 121:06 Okay, I got a couple questions about your career and moments I remember. Number one, maybe what would you consider your signature game? Like if you were to say, watch one game of me that I'm most proud of, is there one you'd pick? 121:24 Yeah, probably the night that Patrick's number went up. 121:30 That was a pretty big moment for me. Yeah. 121:34 If I recall right, I played really well that night. 121:41 Like I said earlier, it's just special to be a part of ceremonies and a part of history, and I think that night I played pretty well. 121:49 It was special to be able to take part in that whole process. 121:54 Do your kids wear your gold medal? 121:57 No, they don't. It stays in a little... 122:04 Drawer is not the right word for it. It's an island with a glass top and it sits under there with my rings and the stick that the Canadians presented to me for 315 wins. 122:19 It sits there. It's still special to me. I actually use that table for tackle assembly and whatnot for fishing more than anything. Wow. 122:33 But it's a pretty cool room. I think there's been some shots of it in previous interviews. It's got masks and pads and stuff like that, knickknacks and paddywhacks that I've collected over my career. 122:47 What are some of the more unique things? Is it all stuff from your careers or anything you've got of other guys or teammates? Yeah. 122:56 Yeah, there's so many things that I wish I would have collected earlier in my career, but when you're in it, you don't really think of the end of your career when you're trying to establish yourself or stay in the league. There's so many sticks that I wish I would have collected, but I do have a good collection of stuff from guys that I played with that mean a lot to me and have meant a lot to me. 123:22 And, you know, guys that I've had a ton of respect for playing against. 123:26 Was there anybody that you were particularly sheepish about skating up to them or asking them for something? 123:34 Yeah, probably Ovi and Sid. I think I... Generally how it works is you ask your trainer to ask their trainer to ask for a stick, you know? 123:45 But, you know, obviously those two guys I had a ton of respect for and played against a lot, and they were always... 123:51 a pain for me to play against, but I knew I had to get there. I knew I had to get those two sticks specifically for when it was all done. 124:00 Okay. The best defensive team I've ever seen was the 2014 Canadian Olympic team. 124:08 I remember that semifinal game against the Americans, Canada won 1-0, but I think that game could have gone on for five days and the U.S. would never have scored. That's how good you guys were. And I wanted to ask you about that team specifically and playing for it. And I just remember when it was over, Marc Bergevin once told a story about just how proud he was of the way you carried yourself through that entire tournament and on and off the ice. 124:38 And maybe just your memories of that and that team, because I couldn't believe I was so impressed with how good you guys were team defensively. 124:49 Yeah, I think that was the key to everything. 124:55 I think that really came down to, I just remember, I think it was during that game, And we're going into the third period and I'm looking around the room. I'm like, okay, captain, captain, captain, captain, captain, assistant, captain, assistant, captain, you know, like everybody is just like such a well-respected leader within their own organizations. And then it's just like, everybody's just saying things. And it's just like, you know, I said that during my speech, I just don't think a team could ever be matched in terms of leadership. 125:32 Like it was just, you know, just everybody knew what they had to do, how they had to do it. 125:37 They knew the situation, how to deal with the situation. You know, you just couldn't help but just sit there and feel like, okay, we got this. I just do my job and we got this. You know, just there was never like a sense of what ifs or panic or... 125:54 you know, fear. It was just, I got to do my job. If I do my job, we're going to get, we're going to win. You know, it was just like, there was just no doubt. 126:05 So one woman I wanted to ask about, Kerry, would have been seven years prior to that, also a semifinal against the United States at the World Juniors, that shootout. And I was going back and watched. First of all, you were incredible in the overtime. That big penalty kill just to get it to the shootout. And then there was a lot of time in between the overtime ending and the shootout starting. So I wonder what you remember about handling your mind with all that time in between. And then, of course... Any memories of the shootout itself? 126:36 Because that's one of the all-time greats. 126:39 Yeah, it was definitely a memorable one. Good call, Kyle. Yeah, I felt like it took forever, you know? It was like my first thrust into a spotlight position, you know? 126:57 Because we hadn't, in Tri-Cities, we hadn't gone on deep playoff runs. So like making that team and going through that experience, I just felt like it was kind of, I wouldn't say like a coming out party, but it definitely, winning that tournament kind of really helped propel my career forward. And I just remember, yeah, it was incredibly stressful. It was just, I've never been a big fan of shootouts in general. Yeah. 127:27 You know, but I'm just like, I'm really thankful that we had JT there. 127:32 Who was calmer, you or him? 127:34 Oh, definitely him. Definitely him. He was just, you know, Captain Sirius was just like, he just, I don't know. I just always kind of felt like he was just, from that moment, I just felt like he was just built for those types of pressure situations. 127:51 Well, I have to say, Kerry, when you stop Mueller there to finally end it, I think of all the post-game, post-win reactions I've seen in your career, that may have been the most emphatic, raw, emotional one in terms of what you looked like then. So, yeah, you talk about pressure pack. That was something. Yeah. 128:11 And the save on Patrick Kane midway through, where it's right in between your legs there and turning your pads to the side. I mean, this, of course, is a time where there aren't the same amount of camera angles then as there are now. But do you remember in that moment just the wherewithal to slide your legs across to not leave any doubt? Yeah. 128:33 Yeah. I was just, I had black pads on and I knew that nobody was going to be able to see anything or anywhere. So I just, I did my best to keep my whole, my whole body thing going in the net. Um, Yeah. It was a pretty good lineup of shooters that they had. Oh, what a game. Yeah. What a game. Like Pete, I played against Pete quite a bit because he was an average, right? So he's a divisional rival team. And he had scored five hole on me in a shootout earlier that year. 129:03 So I was kind of thinking in the back of my mind that he was going to go five hole at some point. 129:09 I think he made a couple of really good moves. He was a really talented player. 129:15 I just was like, I know he's going to go five hole eventually and kind of sat on that. 129:20 Ultimately, it came down to that being the save. 129:24 Wow. That's amazing. I'm glad you shared that because I know how goalie mind works, and I'm glad you shared that. Okay, I got a couple more, and then we'll let you get out of this torture. 129:37 Number one, I always remember the hug with Shea Weber, and I remember watching it at the time after the 2021 Stanley Cup final and thinking there's something going on here that we don't know because all these guys are coming together. to Weber. Um, just that moment, uh, of, uh, you, the, how much you guys loved him. And obviously you knew what we didn't know that it was over for him. 130:08 Yeah. It's, you know, it was, uh, you know, we're all on our back nine, so to speak, you know? 130:15 And, uh, we, at that point, like we were just all, we were, everybody's exhausted, you know, it's a, it's such a, it's such a, It's such a pressure-packed grind, you know what I mean? And we just knew that we came to the end of it. Everybody's banged up. And Webbs is playing on one leg, and we just knew that this was going to be, could be, you know, our one shot. And Webbs is such a, he's such a presence in a locker room, you know. 130:52 Yeah, he speaks a lot. 130:55 Well, not like a lot, a lot. I would say he's more like me. When he speaks, it carries a lot of weight. He had such an impact on a lot of those guys in that locker room. 131:10 We were all feeling it. Play so hard for that long and be so close. We just knew that it was just a really emotional time. 131:21 Every one of us needs somebody who kicks their tail from time to time. And I always love the Andre Markov story. I would love it if you could take us through what happened that day. 131:34 Oh, you're probably referring to earlier in my career. Yeah. The morning skate. Yes. Yes. Yeah. Um, Mark, he was always funny. Like he's, he's a man of even fewer words, you know? 131:49 And it was kind of like, I'll share this too. Like, I remember like in morning skate, we do goalie breakouts. Right. 131:55 And I remember like, if I didn't put it like right on his tape, right where he wanted it, he kind of give me that look. Like, what are you doing? You know? 132:06 but I just I remember like it was it was early in my career and I was kind of going through kind of going through a hard time like it was like growing as a player and as a person really you know it was a bit of growing pains when I started my career and you know Marky Marky came up to me and he was he was He kind of like, we kind of had an exchange in the locker room. 132:40 And then, you know, after it was, it was a very brief, I didn't put too much thought in us a little bit defensive, but he came up to me, we went over to, we were in the gym kind of cooling down and he came over to me and just said, you know, I know, I know you're trying, we just need you to, we need you to work hard and, and be a, be a solid presence in this room. 133:04 And like Mark, he has always been just like that. He's quiet, but just a presence. And I think, you know, from that time forward, that's kind of how I tried to carry myself. And from that time forward, I started to grow as a goalie and, you know, You know, as a professional, and I just can't thank Marky enough for the impact that he had on my career, because everybody sees him as a stoic person, which he is, but not many people get to see how much he cares for others and... 133:38 And how much funny actually is, you know, so I just I'm just very thankful to have a have a guy like that as a veteran early in my career. 133:49 He would terrify me with that look because he always looks so serious. Like if he came up to me and I would be I'd be like, yes, sir, whatever you want, sir. 133:58 Yeah. The general. Yeah. His eyes got wide. 134:02 Oh boy. 134:03 The last thing, the last thing. Oh, go ahead. Go ahead, Kerry. 134:06 I was just saying, just saying what I said before. He just like, he commanded, he commanded respect. I'm sure it's the era that he grew up in, right? Like, you know, like he grew up in an era where, you know, things are serious and this is how it is. And I want you to behave accordingly, you know, so yeah. 134:24 You know, it was, like I said, I got to hang out with several of the veterans that I had early in my career last night. 134:34 And I just, like, it took a moment to say, like, that group of veterans is just amazing. You know, like, they understand what, they all understood what it was like to be in Montreal. They all understood what it was like to be a young adult learning how to be a pro in Montreal. So... You know, just an amazing group of guys that I got to play with early in my career. 134:59 The last people I wanted to ask you about, and your dad, Jerry, is listening and your mom, Linda, and you've talked a lot about how hugely important they both were in your life. And, you know, I wonder, you know, your dad is a man of few words. I don't know if I've ever interviewed your mom before, but I just wanted to know what they said to you as this week approached and they went through it. 135:27 Yeah, I was just, you know, obviously, I don't think there'll ever be enough I could say about my parents and, you know, the sacrifice that they made for me to just even have the opportunity to play hockey. You know, this was part of the speech that, you know, I kind of had, I just knew I wasn't going to be able to thank them enough for for the sacrifices and the traveling and the airplanes. 136:03 There was just no way that I was going to be able to get through all of that on an emotional level during my speech. But, you know, I just can't thank them enough. I really can't. And, you know, they've always been, they just always have been there. 136:23 through hard times that I've gone through. They've just been just a steady presence in my life, and they've always been the types of people that keep me grounded. They're godly people, and I'm just thankful, so thankful for having the upbringing that I had when I was a kid. 136:45 Your dad was drafted by the Flyers. When did he finally admit to you that you were a better goalie than he was? 136:53 Ah, he never said it. 137:01 I just think it came to, I think like when I started to play junior and whatnot, you know, he had a big impact on me when I was a young goaltender. He knew, he grew up and played goal in a different era, but He knew the fundamentals and taught me fundamentals at a very young age. And one of the most important things I think he ever told me, well, there's two actually. 137:29 One was technical. Just don't move more than you had to. You know, reduce as much unnecessary movement as possible. And I think that's kind of really was a foundation of my game because everybody always says, well, you're solid technically and seem so sound. Well, that came from that. 137:47 Yeah. 137:49 And then two would just be, you know, stop the next shot. You know, regardless of what happened, stop the next one. You know, I always kind of try to keep that at the back of my mind. And I think those two things really kind of sum up the way that I played and the way I thought. 138:11 Kerry, do you want, just before we leave, do you want to promote the product again so that we can end the interview making sure you mention it again and why you believe in it? 138:21 Yeah, like again, I partnered with Energy Bird after a trial period and I'm a guy that likes to take care of himself and I try and only promote products that I use and that I rely on and believe in and You know, I've used their products now for a few months and I'm thankful for our partnership and appreciate their products and what they do to help my quality of life. 138:53 That's great. Well, Kerry, I can just tell you, when I first moved to Montreal, I was young, figuring out this business, really didn't know what I was doing in the grand scheme of things. I just, I always appreciated the respect and kindness that you gave me in that time. It meant the world at that stage of things. So yeah, we're so happy for everything that you've enjoyed here over the last week. And thanks for all the great memories we've been able to watch over your career and for the time today. 139:23 You know, thanks guys. I've always appreciated you guys. And now as a spectator, I really enjoy watching you guys. You guys bring a lot to the game of hockey. So great job guys. 139:35 Our thanks once again to Kerry. That was such a treat for his time there. And thanks to all of you for continuing to make time to follow along here with us. Taking us out today is a track from Loviet, a powerhouse of 90s-tinged indie rock, alternative pop. Loviet has made a name for herself, supporting critically acclaimed artists like The Beaches, Giant Rooks, and Jesse Joe Stark, and performing at festivals such as Lollapalooza. Praised for her signature shimmery hooks with emotionally honest lyrics and addictive retro pop rock, Loviet, née Natalie Lynn, has spent the last five years in Toronto honing her craft and touring throughout Canada, UK, Canada. 140:20 and the U.S. She is the winner of Music Nova Scotia's Rock Recording of the Year in 2024 and the East Coast Music Awards Breakthrough Artists of the Year in 2025 for her EP The Nighttime is All in the Timing. Her new self-produced record, Debutante, features the most unblushing, rock-driven portrayal of the artist to date. You can see her next week, November the 18th, in Montreal. This is Loviet and Feeder taking us out on 32 Pots, the podcast. 140:56 He takes his coffee with the Then kisses me with eyes open, yeah Sometimes it feels just like I never left 141:54 The bittersweet says, it all tastes like hay The haze is always worse this time That's what he said. 144:05 You're welcome.